My problem with eBay, the evil Bog

This is a compilation of messages on the eBay site. It’s long, but I believe instructive in the risk you take as a buyer, and I hope it’s amusing, because I had fun!

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So I bought a refurb’ed “Western Digital WD TV Live Plus built in WI-FI Streaming HD Media Player 1080P” from a dealer on the E-Bog, at about a US$20 discount.

It’s defective but not unuseable, in that 1 of 2 USB ports doesn’t work.

Here’s our messages:

Sent Date: Jan-22-13 19:39:39 PST

Dear centrix-intl.com,

Western Digital WD TV Live Plus built in WI-FI Streaming HD Media Player 1080P

USB port 1 does not work

– mmmeeevvv
======================
Sent Date: Jan-23-13 09:12:15 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Our apologies upon this matter, at this time we can either set up a replacement or a refund for you. Which option would you prefer?

Brandon

– centrix-intl.com
======================
Sent Date: Jan-24-13 04:22:13 PST

Dear centrix-intl.com,

Replacement, please.

– mmmeeevvv
======================
Sent Date: Jan-24-13 10:21:51 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Please use the below information to send the item back:

Return Number: XXXXX (Please write this on the outside of the package along with your first and last name and make sure the item is packed safely for return).

Return Address:

Centrix International
XXXXXX
La Verne, CA 91750

– centrix-intl.com
======================
Dear centrix-intl.com,

Let me get this straight:
You want me
1. to return the item at my cost; and,
2. then await shipment of a replacement item that I have already paid for?

Unacceptable.

I am not your quality-control agent – which you appear to lack – nor am I spending another dime on your defective product.

I will accept a full refund.

I will return the item – without charging you for packing and bringing to the shipper – if you pay return shipping.

– mmmeeevvv

(Stay toont!  Grin)

===================================

Sent Date: Jan-24-13 16:25:22 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Give us a email address we can have a return label sent to

– centrix-intl.com
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Dear centrix-intl.com,

I tried and got this message:
For your safety, eBay does not allow the exchange of email addresses in member to member communications . This protects both buyers and sellers by keeping a track record of communications. It also helps ensure that transactions happen on eBay so buyers and sellers are covered by eBay protection programs.

Please remove the email address and resend your message.

If you want to receive photos from another eBay member, you do not need to share your email address. Buyers and sellers can now attach images to messages sent from eBay by using the “Attach Photos” button.

– mmmeeevvv

(I’m just waiting to see how they reply to that!  Grin)
=====================

Sent Date: Jan-24-13 16:25:22 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Give us a email address we can have a return label sent to

– centrix-intl.com
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Sent Date: Jan-24-13 16:53:50 PST

Dear centrix-intl.com,

I tried and got this message:
For your safety, eBay does not allow the exchange of email addresses in member to member communications . This protects both buyers and sellers by keeping a track record of communications. It also helps ensure that transactions happen on eBay so buyers and sellers are covered by eBay protection programs.

Please remove the email address and resend your message.

If you want to receive photos from another eBay member, you do not need to share your email address. Buyers and sellers can now attach images to messages sent from eBay by using the “Attach Photos” button.

– mmmeeevvv
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Sent Date: Jan-25-13 09:18:22 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Write it like this:

for example… john dot doe at gmail dot com

– centrix-intl.com
===============================
chuckle

Now, obviously this guy can’t figure me out.  So, do I give my email for the $64, or just use the thing with a crippled USB and give them a shite rating for selling defective merch, trying to con me into paying for the return, refusing to return my money immediately and/or replace the object without my returning first, etc.

That’s the last time I buy refurb offa E-bog!  mad)

==========================

Sent Date: Jan-27-13 22:22:29 PST

Dear centrix-intl.com,

How quickly do I receive refund if I ship this back to you?

– mmmeeevvv
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Sent Date: Jan-28-13 08:37:03 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Refund will be done as soon as we receive the returned item

Brandon

– centrix-intl.com
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Dear centrix-intl.com,

So we are clear, because of your failure to quality-check your refurbished merchandise, my choice – now that you have agreed to pay return shipping – is that I await the refund of my immediately-paid-to-you money until you receive the return of the defective merchandise, or continue to use the defective item (to the extent it is usable) and give you a bad rating.

– mmmeeevvv

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Sent Date: Jan-28-13 11:05:24 PST
Dear mmmeeevvv,

You can either send the item back and give us your email address to send a pre paid postage label and get the item back so we can refund you, or you can keep the item, your choice. However by 30 days your warranty with us is gone.

Brandon

– centrix-intl.com
========================
Dear centrix-intl.com,

I find that incredibly unfair.

How about you send a replacement item immediately, in that I note that despite my immediate payment, the item was not received for 11 days, and was clearly not quality checked despite being “refurbished”.

To the extent the item works defectively, I can use it until the replacement is received, and will then mail the defective one back immediately.

I do not see why I should be without the item, and/or without my money and therefore ability to replace the item, due to your business practices.

– mmmeeevvv

==================================

Sent Date: Jan-28-13 13:19:52 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

In any store in order to exchange an item you must present the defective merchandise first. Asking us to send you a replacement without a returned item is like walking into a retail store and telling the store you want to exchnage a product but you will return the other one when you go home and test it and then you promise to return it. That is not how things work.

You also say this is because of our “Business Practices” but in reality this can happen to anyone. We do test the players to prevent returns as much as possible, but we are not batting 100% either. No one is. Any store no matter how big or small when working with electronics this kind of thing happens. The item you received comes from Western Digital Direct we don’t buy from 3rd parties we are direct Authorized Resellers.

My staff has offered to provide prepaid postage so the exchange is free of cost. I think that is more than fair. I do see your point of view also tho and am willing to work with you to resolve this. So how about this. Since ebay only protects the buyer and not the seller in returns this is why we have the item come back first, but if your willing to provide us a credit card on file to put on Hold in Case the defective one isn’t returned then I will ship you the replacement today. I will even cover 3 day air shipping to you. If you would like to take this option please contact me at 909-480-3000 ext 107

Thank You

– centrix-intl.com

==============================
Dear mmmeeevvv,

Another option we have is we can do a advanced replacement where we ship the item today, all we request is your CC info in the case that you will return this item. If the item does not arrive to us we will take the funds out of the account. If it does arrive then the hold on the Card will be lifted. Would you like to do that?

Brandon

– centrix-intl.com
==============================
Dear centrix-intl.com,

In any store in order to exchange an item you must present the defective merchandise first.
**You are not “any store”, and your rational illustrates why I do not think buying from you was a good idea.

Asking us to send you a replacement without a returned item is like walking into a retail store and telling the store you want to exchange a product but you will return the other one when you go home and test it and then you promise to return it.
***Asking you, a business already giving me a hard time – starting with expecting me to pay return postage until I called you on that, a 5 day delay to ship so that the item is received 11 days later despite the representation of , “Our goal is to ship the next business day …”  – is not like what you say, but rather is asking you to fulfill your commitment of delivering the not-defective product I bought, and letting me use the defective-but-usable one until the good one arrives. Think of my retaining the first one until the second is received as a loaner, which I feel I am fairly requesting in that you provided a defective item in the first place.  It didn’t occur to me to keep the first until the second arrives and I can test *it* – are you afraid, as I now am, that it will be defective, also?

That is not how things work
***However you think things work is irrelevant to me.  I know how they ought to work, starting with proper quality control and including trust in a paying customer and that customer’s satisfaction.

It is your business practices that are at issue, not mine. You choose to do business on E-Bay, as I did (altho’ I shall no longer buy refurbished anything, nor from you again) and while I understand your perceived need to protect yourself, it is insulting, unfair, and a rip-off to me, the consumer.

Let me note that contrary to E-Bay policies you have not only requested my email – which good sense and privacy concerns restrain me from forwarding – but now want my Credit Card number. Unacceptable.

– mmmeeevvv

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Sent Date: Jan-28-13 14:35:52 PST

Dear mmmeeevvv,

Our staff has already provided you all return details already. And provided you prepaid postage.

We are now just awaiting you to return the item. You are right you are not obligated to provide us with a credit card. This was just an option I offered you to get done what you wanted.

We are not getting anywhere arguing back and forth. These are the only options we are presenting you. They are 1 to replace the unit, 2 to refund you fully (In both option we provided you a return label to cover all cost) And we still leave the Advance replacement option on the table.

The choice is yours. If you are not satisfied with these then you may contact ebay and open a resolution center case and let them decide how to proceed

Thank You
Victor Lopez

– centrix-intl.com
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Dear centrix-intl.com,

Just to document my position relative to your inaccurate and slanted statements below:

1. you have *not* provided return postage – you have *offered* to, if I give you my email (in violation of Ebay policy) which I decline to do;

2. “replacing the unit” still results in me being without such unit –  as stated, it’s partially defective as you sold it to me but currently usable – until I receive another questionable item from you, which you won’t ship until you receive the defective unit you so belatedly sent me the first time;

3. “refunding” still results in me being without such unit with you holding onto my money preventing me from purchasing a new non-defective unit elsewhere until you decide to refund me, which you won’t do until you receive the defective unit.

If any of the above is incorrect, please advise immediately.

In light of the ultimatum you present – “These are the only options we are presenting you” – I will make no counter-offer.

Finally, I note that your frustration – so evident in the tone of your last message – is less that 1% of mine, dealing with your “business practices”.

– mmmeeevvv

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From:  eBay
Sent:  Jan-30-13 08:43 AM
Hi mmmeeevvv,

We let the seller know the item wasn’t as described.

The seller has offered you a full refund for the purchase price plus original shipping if you return the item. To get your refund, ship the item back to the seller. You will need to cover the cost of returning the item. Make sure you ship the item by Feb 02, 2013.

Refund information:
Once the item is delivered to the seller, you will receive a full refund of $64.00.The refund will include the purchase price plus original shipping.

You can view the details of this case and learn what you need to do to ship the item back in the Resolution Center.
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The seller’s new offer is worse than their last offer made directly to me re postage and shipping – please read the messages; this offer is refused.

Seller belatedly sent a defective item and now refuses to pay return postage, refuses to refund money until receipt of returned item; refuses to ship replacement until receipt of returned item. This was never agreed to.

Bad business, unscrupulous practice by over-reaching seller who without notice has retracted its offer. I want 100% refund + return postage after which I will return item and leave no feedback.

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Hello MIchael,
We’re contacting you about the case you opened for Western Digital WD TV Live Plus built in WI-FI Streaming HD Media Player 1080P.
As a courtesy, we’re covering your return shipping costs by providing you a prepaid label to return the item. It’s important that you ship the item back in the next 7 days so you can get a refund.

Be sure to pack the item carefully and securely and to include all parts of the item. The seller must receive the item in the same condition that you received it for you to be eligible for your refund.
To print the label, paste the link below into your browser:
XXXX
Attach the label to the box, and send the item back to the seller using United Parcel Service (UPS) shipping.
We’ll enter the tracking information from the label into the Resolution Center. Once we have confirmation that the item has been delivered, we’ll refund you within 3 days for the cost of the item plus original shipping (as long as the seller hasn’t issued you a refund).
If you decide not to use our prepaid shipping label, you’ll need to pay for shipping and add tracking information to your case. If your transaction is $250.00 or over, you must ship with signature confirmation.
To add tracking information to your case:
1. Go to the Resolution Center:
http://resolutioncenter.ebay.com
2. Click the “Take action” link to the right of the case.
3. Click the blue “Respond to case” button.
4. Select the “Provide a tracking number” option.
5. Enter the tracking number and shipping carrier (such as USPS, UPS, FedEx, etc.) into the boxes.
6. Click the “Submit” button.
You can check the status of the case by going to the Resolution Center:
http://resolutioncenter.ebay.com
Here are the details of this case:
Claim ID: XXXX
Item: Western Digital WD TV Live Plus built in WI-FI Streaming HD Media Player 1080P
I hope this helps explain how to use the prepaid shipping label.
If you have any questions, please click “Customer Support” at the top of most eBay pages.
Sincerely,
KimMaris
eBay Customer Service
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I feel this is an unfair resolution in that my money is tied up until the seller receives the returned item + up to 3 days to refund me.

This is unacceptable; they delivered 11 days after purchase despite promises and I will again be without the use of the item and with out MY MONEY, as stated above.

If it is the best that you can do, please advise so that I can close my Ebay account; you will have lost an Ebay customer.
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Dear Michael, Thank you for contacting eBay Customer Support in regard to the case XXXXXXX. I understand that you are asking for a full refund for the returned item. I know how frustrating is it when you have done your part and you still have not yet received the requested refund. Let me help you with your concern.Before anything else, I would like to thank you for being loyal to eBay for 551 days now. Please know that the professional manner in which you have handled yourself in this situation is most commendable. We thank you for your trust in our site and we guarantee you that will find eBay as one of the best place to shop online.Upon further review, I notice that we have asked you to return the item for a full a refund as you have received a non working device. As a courtesy, we have issued a shipping label to compensate the return shipping costs in returning the item. We have given you until February 10, 2013 to return the item.Please do understand that for us to hold the seller accountable for issuing you a refund a full refund, we need you to send the item back to the seller. Once we confirm the delivery, we will issue you the full refund which will take effect within 3 days after this claim has been closed. Michael, I’m sorry to hear that you’d like to close your eBay account as you are not satisfied with our service however you are a valued eBay member, so if there’s anything we can do to change your mind please let us know.I trust that this information is helpful. If you have further questions please do reply to this email. Thanks for choosing eBay.Sincerely,Romanina D.eBay Customer Support

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Once again, Ebay’s response is unacceptable.  This seller was rude, duplicitous, delaying, clearly and repeatedly breached Ebay’s seller’s rules, reneged on a prior offer, and has had the use of my money – immediately paid and collected – for over a month, and Ebay’s best solution is that I wait another two weeks for the refund.

Therefore, be advised that not only will I never purchase from that seller again, I will never purchase from any such commercial seller on Ebay, and will so advise anyone who will listen.

I truly feel that you (Ebay) fell on your face in this matter, I am extremely unhappy with both the dishonesty and gaming of the seller, and Ebay’s enabling of same.

That Ebay does not adequately protect the consumer is indisputable through this example; I am happy it was such a relatively nominal loss I have sustained.

Shame on both of you.

Finally, I wash my hands of this matter. The seller may keep the money and choke on it – I shall do my best to publicize this experience.
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(Smile, and drink heavily!  Grin)

Pyle!

 <—-8  click

 

The reason I post this is to show the changing landscape of sexuality in America.  When I was a kid, we were scandalized by Nabors’ and Rock Hudson’s allege affair; that George Takei (Mr. Sulu) was gay never occurred to us.

I can recall fans denying that Liberace was gay, and the same for Little Richard.

People freaked about Jagger and Reed and Bowie …

It wasn’t that long ago that Michael Stipe calling himself “an equal opportunity lecher” in Details magazine was a headliner.

Now this, on the “entertainment” page, and it’s so “routine”, you probably wouldn’t even know about it otherwise.

thumbsup

 68.20.34.230

carpal diem!

TFPTHDvlaymanblog

New Vlayman album: *Sad Old Train*

 <— click
1. Sad Old Train 03:15
2. Stir Crazy 02:49
3. Missing Us (w/ Grankspoine) 03:58
4. Final 03:27
5. The Perp Walk 03:11
6. Sackcloth & Ashes 02:58
7. My Best T-Shirt 03:31
8. Funky Claude 04:09
9. Ripped @ the T’s 02:58
10. The Bottom of Me 03:42

Trains, martoonies, bad guys and gals, and a eulogy.
Released 28 January 2013.
By Vlayman, with some help from England’s Grankspoine, and Scotland’s Virtualan & son.
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TFPTHDvlaymanblog

Dubstep (Dorset-stylee)

Asked by a English friend to comment on some dubstep he posted from a musician in his viillage, I hadda say:

Keep him there.

I mean, it’s aiight for what it is, but I never wanna hear it again, am sorry I heard it once’t, and really miss stuff like the old REM (Reckoning) I was just listening to.

This stuff, BTW, would be ever so much better w/out the “vocals”.

And the prog’d drums and techno sounds.

And if it had guitars and proper singing.

And sounded more like old REM (Reckoning).

Wanna see most of my mic’s?

Aiight, so it’s silly, but I took pic’s for insurance, made a slide show with some comments.

Go here, download the pic if ya need the name.

Randumb CD reviews

That Steve Cropper record is great.

I’ve also been enjoying Soul Sessions 2, and the recent re-masters of the Sugar catalog, and the latest Don Fagen and Bob Mould, and the two Dead Weather records, and the last two Smashing Pumpkins records, and Bringing Down the Horse.

I must warn anyone attempting to follow in my footsteps, do spread these selections out over a few days, or you will get dizzy. Twisted Evil

Diggin’ Gary Clark, Jr.’s rather eclectic first full-length; lotsa soul, Hendrix/Vaughn, Prince influences and a hip-hop tune. What really amuses me is that I so like his playing, but hate his lead tones.  Still, “Bright Lights, Big City” (re-done from the EP or just re-mixed?) shall become a classic.  “You’re gonna know my name …”

James McMurtry, Childish Things: a guest shot from Joe Ely, and some of the greatest, erudite lyrics of the last half-dozen yers – plays guitar, also, and has Dave Grissom and Bukka Allen.

Those Bastard Souls; 20th Century Chemicals: I love me some Grifters, and this is close.

Bob Mould, Silver Age: he’s so fucking under-rated it’s a crime.

Dr. John, Rhino Best Of: even “Iko-Iko” rocks. (I have a cuppla teens and I was just ‘splaining to ’em that two years before the oldest was born I spent 5 daze around Mardi Gras down there, drank in Tipi’s, met some local gurrls and some imported strippers (didn’t tell the kids that part Twisted Evil ), drank a lot and karaoke’d a lot and drank some more and …
… anywhat, every bar we went in had sing-alongs and that year it was some Garth Brooks tune about latigo {looked it up, “Rodeo”}, and “Iko”, which was much better, altho’ I must have heard it 20 times.) I always wanted to walk on gilded splinters, not stick ’em in my ears (like Garth made me wanna do).

Grace Potter & the Nocturnals, eponymous: I wanna do her even if/as she over-emotes, and the band is shit-hot.

Audioslave, eponymous: too bad about the smashing, because the performances are “A+”, and the songs never below a “B”.

The Essential Nina Simone ; other than the sometimes annoying vibrato it’s great stuff, especially the Dylan covers.

Psychedelic Pill, what may be Neil Young’s Physical Graffiti.

Graham Parker, with The Rumor! Three Chords Good – and it is.

Patterson Hood – Killing Oscar. As good as any all-Hood DBT – sure I miss Cooley’s and Shauna’s (who’re on here in places along with the rest of DBT) songs and singing, but this is truly excellent, written mostly in ’94 and recorded in ’05, kinda a lost DBT record.

Chris Cornell – Carry On. I still haven’t bought Soundgarden’s latest, but I do enjoy this ever so much more than Scream, altho’ my teen daughter digs both.

Silversun Pickups – Neck of the Woods. I’m not big on the drium sound -it’s so annoying I hafta mention it (latest Bush, also) but other than that, solid.

Bauhaus – Go Away White. If you are a fan, well, this is my fave, after Gotham.

Vlayman: “The Perp Walk”

The Perp Walk
c. ’13 Vlayman Products

You walk outta there with yer coat over yer hands
You walk outta there, lookin’ so grand
Except ya got, yer coat over yer hands
You walk outta there, lookin’ so grand

Doin’ the perp walk

You was waitin’ there, altho’ ya thought about runnin’
You act like you ain’t care, that they was comin’,
And now ya got yer head down on yer chest,
And we don’t think, ya really lookin’ yer best

Doin’ the perp walk 2x

That you’d get caught, was just inevitable,
And them you bought, is now regretable
They’re like you, inna police parade
All dressed up, and goin’ away

Doin’ the perp walk 3x

Drums: krister-edited
Bass: Alvz-Eden WTDI-Brick
LdVoc: GAPd1-Summit-MeekC2
BV’s: SM58-Summit-MeekC2
Gtrs: SG-Elektar_2x12″-RE10-ISA1_MXL144-EurekaCmp
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TFPTHDvlaymanblog